It seems that it would be accurate to start referring to it as "The Republican Flag." It would seem the majority of Republicans would agree with that and I think that symbolically it would represent the real nature of the partisan divide much better. Edit: My first badge; thank you kind stranger.
It certainly has little to do with Southern Pride anymore. You see people proudly flying it all over the US. I think it's more about the distinctions that exist in the US--metropolitan vs. rural, progressive vs. regressive--and how these line up with other political divisions. The flag has come to represent "country pride", but the people that claim that sort of pride are also heavily Republican. It's just the same political, social, and geographic differences that have already existed in the US for the last 30 and 40 years attached to a new issue, and people are incapable of seeing eye-to-eye on this issue (just like every other political debate in the US).
I don't really think that stands up well against the reasons for flying it and adding it to state flags. (in response to the civil rights act, for god's sake). It's been pretty well covered on reddit - but the AskHistorians threads and faq were the most persuasive to me. I was inclined to believe as you do. Now I view it quite differently. Certainly the idea of embracing a symbol that's deeply offensive to many when there are many other symbols that could have been used that would have been equally evocative.
I hope I didn't sound supportive of flying the Confederate flag or anything like that--wasn't my point. I guess I just feel that the identity of those who embrace and support the Confederate flag has drifted from a strict Southern Pride definition to a more flexible identity that falls in line with a lot of different social, political, and geographic divisions in the US. I mean I've lived in the North all my life and you see a fair number of people with Confederate flags on their cars or their hats or whatever if you get out of the cities. Do you have a link to the AskHistorians post? I'd be interested to read it.
well, there are a number. https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/search?q=confederate+flag&restrict_sr=on&sort=relevance&t=all And some actually support your view. --- https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/3cg2sq/ama_john_coski_author_of_the_confederate_battle/ Sorry, can't format links properly, my eyes are drifting in different directions atm. Must sleep. :)
Lets make an agreement everybody. Let's stop talking about the fucking confederate flag, until we get this whole TPP thing figured out and shut down. Seriously, this is definitely an issue, but it's one that can in my opinion can be left on the backburner until this whole 'corporations literally overruling sovereign governments' thing gets worked out.
So the 21st century's confederate flag is the 20th century's swastika? The evolution of symbolic language is a fascinating one, fraught with complexities. I can remember, decades later, the shudders that the phrase "Piss Christ" sent through the American sociopolitical landscape.
I'm out of the loop on this one. Would you kindly explain why everyone suddenly gives a shit about the Confederate Flag? Have we run out of more important things to talk about since marraige equality went through? Genuinely curious. Edit - Thanks for the insightful answers, guys. Much appreciated!
As an addendum to what lelibertaire said, the Confederate flag wasn't able to be flown at half-mast because of the way it was installed. So, while every other flag was flown at half-mast to commemorate the shooting victims, you had this single flag, which so happened to be the same flag that the asshole shooter liked taking pictures of, proudly flown at full mast.
Racist shoots up historically black church in Charleston, South Carolina. People notice the Confederate Flag flies over the South Carolina statehouse and demand its removal. Threats and critique of the flag draw our supporters and opponents to debate. Today, South Carolina's government voted to take the flags down because "they belong in a museum!" You can still be paying attention to all the important things while this is going on. Taking that flag down won't alleviate all racial tension, but it's surely a good move. It only represents pride to a small portion of people. It represents a lot more to most others. I'm from the South, but I'm fine with it becoming a social stigma. But I've never understood flying that flag, even as a kid.
Thanks! I guess my followup question would be "why didn't we do that after the Confederacy lost?" I assume something to do with the states having a bit of rebellion still and the Union not being able or willing to go down to enforce it. You'd think someone would've had an issue with it before now.
That flag wasn't actually used to represent the confederacy while the confederacy existed; it was rejected. It got popular during World War 2, because units made up of southerners liked to fly it to represent their southerness. Then the Dixicrats picked it up, and it started getting flown at state houses and incorporated into flags.
See, I explain it like this: I've never liked the flag because of what it represents to me. But, as you alluded to, it was a such a small issue. There was no point in bringing it up, especially in the South, because the "heritage not hate, pride not racism" crowd would defend it and it'd just end up wasting energy. The shooting put the flag in the political crossfire. The timing allowed people to critique the flag and actually win the political battle. Politicians don't look good defending it right now, really cause there isn't a very good defense of it. I actually think people in S.C. have been trying to get it taken down for months. The shooting just gave them the political momentum. As to why it's stuck around. Well that's a lot of history about reconstruction and the Jim Crow era South. But you're on the right track.